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 An idiots guide to 11m beams

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PostSubject: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2021 11:13 am

Hi everyone,Can I get some advice on beams for the 11m band.As a complete beam novice I’m looking to be pointed in the right direction.3 element or 4 element,how is it tuned and what to look for and what to stay well clear of.Another thing Rotators the good the bad and the ugly?.What about antenna height and space required for rotating.
Thank you Tom.
26 CT 4029
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Bean
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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2021 11:25 am

A siro sy27-3 is a cheap option to start with , about £90 unless your going to roll your own . Turning radius would be in the region of 3m so as long as your gardens 6m wide it will fit , height , the heigher the better but even at 3m it works , 5.5m it will begin to sing . Rotator a Yaesu 450c will be perfect.
Good luck

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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2021 11:32 am

Thanks Bean,I’ll definitely look into that Sirio sy27-3,I’m using a Sirio 5/8 wave antenna now and can’t fault the company.
Thanks again.
Tom. 26 CT 4029
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Alan Pilot
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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2021 6:59 pm

Do many on the 11m band use a beam.
When i go on the 11m band i swap over from the cobweb and go on the vertical antenna.

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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2021 7:10 pm

Hello Alan Pilot,A lot do use a beam on 11m and the difference is quite astonishing.Speaking to someone in Brazil or Europe and their giving you 10DB while using 25 watts and they sound like their only local.I’d be using it for Dx as I do get about with the 5/8 wave Sirio I’m using at the moment,But the directional use of power and signal seem very appealing.I don’t claim to be any expert and truth be told I know sod all on the subject,So any words of wisdom or helpful advice is greatly appreciated.
Cheers Tom.
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Rjbingham
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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2021 7:14 pm

Tom,

Bean is right in what he is saying the cheap Sirio is a good deal, either the 3 or 4 element, buy some good quality coax to make the most of it, minimum RG213 Mil spec coax or above.
I have a couple of low load rotators in the garage that work fine, more than adequate for a sirio yagi, all my rotators are now from SPID, RAK and BIG RAK !!! cost a fortune but bomb proof, let me know mate if you need one, you pay the postage and their yours. You just need to buy some 3 core cable to connect between the rotator and box in the shack.

I will go down in the garage tomorrow and check them both out, to let you know what they are, i had one for a while turning my 12 element Flexyagi on 144mhz, never had a problem.

Regards Ady
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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2021 7:21 pm

Thanks Ady,I’ve got the RG 213U mil spec coax as it’s what I use on my vertical 5/8 wave.I’ll do the homework on the Sirio beam and see what one will fit best and position,I’ll mount it on the house as long as I’m not knocking off neighbours chimney pots..lol
I’ll keep you posted Ady..
Cheers Tom.
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Rjbingham
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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeTue Oct 26, 2021 7:42 pm

Ok mate, if your mounting an antenna on the house, the best brackets you can buy are from Barenco...

https://www.barenco.co.uk/

CU Ady
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Alan - Mirror Man
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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeWed Oct 27, 2021 5:03 pm

I have operated with a beam up in the past it was a 4 element 11M monobander from Lemm, I had to reinforce the elements with some rods I picked up in the local DIY center, they weren't all that rigid and the high winds where I lived soon had them pointing in various directions.  I used T-K brackets and 3 12ft aluminum scaffolding poles with the standard join you used to see on building sights to join them. An idiots guide to 11m beams Downlo21
This looks just about identical to the heavy-duty rotator I managed to acquire second hand, I picked up another, a light-duty one but it would have only been suitable for 2m, 70cms, and television.  I guyed off the mast with steel wire to various points around the garden and for all three twelve-foot poles joined together.  For all this does sound a little precarious it stayed up with no problems at all for several years and operated in conjunction with an Antron 99 with ground plane kit lashed to my chimney I had countless excellent DX contacts just using the standard 20W to the back of my Uniden 28-30.  Make sure your rotator is up to the job buying the lighter duty one was a waste of time.  I acquired a copy of a map which told you which way to direct the beam to contact which area of the world from one of the old radio magazines and had that up on the wall as a guide but you can make those up and personalize them now.  

I found the step up from a Vertical to a beam is very noticeable indeed, it is a whole new kettle of fish as they say and it is a very worthwhile endeavor if you have the space and agreeable neighbors, which sadly, I do not.  Bear the size in mind you have an 18' mast with the equivalent of 4 18' di-poles going across it, it is a large footprint, I toyed with the idea of a dual-element Quad which offered good directional gain but took up a great deal less space to.


An idiots guide to 11m beams Downlo19
An idiots guide to 11m beams Downlo20


Last edited by Alan - Mirror Man on Wed Oct 27, 2021 5:53 pm; edited 1 time in total

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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeWed Oct 27, 2021 5:21 pm

Alan, the rotator in the picture is an AR40, they are expensive new and it's a relatively light load device..... I have a vertical for the 40m band and a 2element yagi also, the difference is staggering. . .. As is the price when you calculate the price for a tower, rebar, cement etc....
Lemm antennas are popular here in France.
Regards Ady


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Alan - Mirror Man
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Call Sign : 108CT233
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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeWed Oct 27, 2021 5:57 pm

Rjbingham wrote:
Alan, the rotator in the picture is an AR40, they are expensive new and it's a relatively light load device..... I have a vertical for the 40m band and a 2element yagi also, the difference is staggering. . .. As is the price when you calculate the price for a tower, rebar, cement etc....
Lemm antennas are popular here in France.
Regards Ady


Due to all this taking place in the 1980's sadly I don't have any images so I used ones I felt were close I found online, I have swapped the image out for a heavy-duty model...sorry for the inaccuracy!
I have listed everything I used apart from the rawl bolts and earthing cable/2m copper pipe, the scaffolding and connections were all free(A friend had a scaffolding company), the beam and rotor came second hand and the brackets were from a previous project and a couple of guy line kits.
I was a teenager at the time, I did it all very cheaply and it worked a treat, staying secure for nearly a decade!

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Northern Crusader
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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeFri Oct 29, 2021 5:30 pm

Sirio SY3 or a Moxon Rectangle. The Moxon is smaller but has similar gain. The Yaesu G450 rotator above is fine. Height wise even just 16-20ft above the ground will see it work great. When I contacted China longpath (the long way around, pointing the opposite way to it) on 10m I was using a Moxon at just 20ft.

You will also want an azimuth map. Because the world is a ball you don't point the antenna the way you think you should looking at a 2D world map in a book. For example to aim to Australia you actually point it north east even though on a 2d map of the world it's south east. Pointing west will see your signal going all the way down the east coast of the USA. You can generate a PDF one on this site here....https://ns6t.net/azimuth/ If you put in IO91um as the location that's London.

Here's one I've done for the UK so you can download and use it.

An idiots guide to 11m beams 304gu7N

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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeFri Oct 29, 2021 6:19 pm

Hello Northern Crusader,First of all thanks for the link to the site and the Azimuthal map and the location for London too,What a top man..👍🏻
I’ve been looking at both Sirio beams 3 and 4 elements and I’ve also seen the Moxon,But this was a homebrew version and not a production model from a factory/shop.Where can these be bought and what sort of price are they?
I’ve spoken to 14 SW 007 and he was using his Moxon and was 2000m asl on the Italian frontier ( Hello Max ) and what a fantastic signal.I’m having second thoughts with the position of the beam as I the turning circle is large and with chimney stacks either side I think I’ll mount it on a mast above the ground,I may also just leave the 5/8 wave Sirio vertical where it is.Anyway I’ll cross that bridge when I get to it.
Thanks again Northern Crusader.
Tom. 26 CT 4029
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Northern Crusader
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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeMon Nov 01, 2021 9:49 pm

Vortex Antennas used to make the best one but he's winding down his business as he's going into retirement but it may be worth contacting him in case he has any still in stock or he will do you a one off as his website says he's still doing the odd builds here and there.

http://www.vortexantennas.co.uk/


Innovantennas have one for 10/11m but at £199 its' not cheap. Martin Lynch have one that's a tenner cheaper but I think I'd go with the Innovantennas one.

https://www.innovantennas.com/en/our-antennas/457/23/11m-cb-yagis/27mhz-moxon-yagi-457InnovAntennas%20shop.html

An 11m moxons turning radius, due to the fact it's only 1.4m long and 4m wide, is just over 2m/6ft, about a metre/ just over 3ft less than the 3 element Sirio but the gain is almost identical.

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PostSubject: Re: An idiots guide to 11m beams   An idiots guide to 11m beams Icon_minitimeMon Nov 01, 2021 10:18 pm

Northern Crusader wrote:
Vortex Antennas used to make the best one but he's winding down his business as he's going into retirement but it may be worth contacting him in case he has any still in stock or he will do you a one off as his website says he's still doing the odd builds here and there.

http://www.vortexantennas.co.uk/


Innovantennas have one for 10/11m but at £199 its' not cheap. Martin Lynch have one that's a tenner cheaper but I think I'd go with the Innovantennas one.

https://www.innovantennas.com/en/our-antennas/457/23/11m-cb-yagis/27mhz-moxon-yagi-457InnovAntennas%20shop.html

An 11m moxons turning radius, due to the fact it's only 1.4m long and 4m wide, is just over 2m/6ft, about a metre/ just over 3ft less than the 3 element Sirio but the gain is almost identical.
Thanks Northern Crusader.👍🏻
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