Sherman X-50 now in the loft....

Hi all,

My Sherman X-50 2m/70cm is now in the loft at home, albeit propped-up for the moment!!  I've made a 15m RG213 cable to connect it to my CRT Electro in any of the upstairs bedrooms, and my first impressions on receive were really good, with full bars on the local 2m repeater, and it even received the 'local' 70cm repeater in the back of the box, yay!!!, which is progress!!  However, I tried the transmit on 2m to the local repeater a few nights ago on 10w, and it didn't even open it up....but my UV 5r Baofeng handheld did?

Answers below please!?!

Cheers gents,

Simon

PS: I have the programming cable for my radio, and I've checked the frequencies for i/o.

Obvious question first, assuming that repeater has an offset, have you set the radio to transmit on the repeaters input frequency?  The fact you can hear it is good, but there may be a setting to enable offset you've missed?

Also, although 2m repeaters don't usually use CTCSS tones (at least, over here they don't), yours may, so check that too....and if the Baofeng works, you at least have a known good config to compare against.

Hi Simon,

You'll probably get/hear a lot of "....is cr@p" statements of your setup or any of the gear associated with it.

Your coax ...is cr@p, your antenna ...is cr@p, your radio ...is cr@p, sticking an antenna in the loft ...is cr@p and many variations thereof!
None of them really helpful at all.

So let's take the basic facts you've presented in that your Baofeng opens the repeater but your CRT does not. 

Is this through the same antenna setup?

In which case my first port of call would be to check that you've set the CRT up correctly for the repeater in question. All too often a simple mistake is made with the CTCSS settings, repeat offsets or the input/output frequency so worth checking there first.

But, if you can open the repeater with the Baofeng on it's stock 'rubbery' antenna but not with CRT despite checking the settings then there's obviously issues with your antenna setup. You'll have to track these down yourself as it's difficult to assist from afar with many only able to offer suggestions.

As for 'suggestions' the best option is 'swapping' things around until you resolve the issue. Hook the Baofeng to the antenna setup, (you'll need an adapter), and see if that works. Take the coax out of the equation by hooking up directly to the X50 with a shorter alternative piece of coax to check the antenna. If it turns out to be the coax then check your terminations and make sure your PL259 connectors are correctly installed. If you've got a NanoVNA, (you previously mentioned getting one), you can use this to also assist you in tracking down the problem.

It shouldn't be too difficult....after all it's just a run of coax with an antenna on the end.


After that you can start to scrutinise/finesse your setup. 

Use the many online calculators/charts available to assess your use of RG213 for VHF/UHF work remembering that shorter lengths equates to less losses. (15m or almost 50 foot is a long run of coax, my upstairs room/shack to the loft antennas is not quite 15 foot!)

Try moving the X50 around the loft area for the best performance making sure it isn't propped/leaned over, sat on/near mains cabling or water piping and maybe in the clear rather than on/by a party wall. A piece of string or cord tied to the top of the antenna so that it hangs vertically from a rafter will be easily moved around but will be resisting against that thick RG213 so route accordingly. Despite what is often said loft mounted antennas can/do work having my own installed as such. (No, rainy days or a snow covered roof doesn't affect the performance either!) If you can or must mount it outside then try and get the antenna up as high as is possible but remember that long coax lengths equals losses again. Low mounted external fixings may mean rather than firing out of a loft space you're firing through the whole house roof depending on the direction of the repeater you're trying to hit!


I wish you good luck with your endeavours.

All the best,
Victor

My mistake is often the input/output frequencies the wrong way round.
Not made that mistake for some time now but did it a few times when i first started.
There input is your output but you know that easy mistake to make if doing it manually.

Alan Pilot wrote:

My mistake is often the input/output frequencies the wrong way round.
Not made that mistake for some time now but did it a few times when i first started.
There input is your output but you know that easy mistake to make if doing it manually.

He said he could hear the repeater fine though, so he must have it’s output frequency correct as his RX frequency…..

When that is the case, it’s usually no offset, wrong offset, or tones, IME.

I know what you mean Alan and people often struggle with these programmable radios.

When I used to scan 2m on my SDR I was amazed at how many times I'd hear people screaming at the repeaters on their output frequency! Also amazing at how often they'd be transmitting to the repeaters without them opening from incorrect CTCSS settings. This was both by new call sign holders as well as old hands obviously trying out a new radio. Of course the operators are usually blind to this fact and despite best efforts on my own part to help it'd usually fall on deaf ears unless they were running simplex without a CTCSS squelch setup.


I stopped scanning in the end.....calls of "Tango-Tango-Charlie for a rig-check" and other such nonsense left me cringing!


I think as suggested by you, Jeff and myself that it might be simply down to incorrect settings/programming and Simon did have issues regards this with his Baofeng when he first got it. Let's hope it's that rather than antenna issues as the former can be done sat on a chair and the latter will mean a climb back into his loft!

Thanks for your replies Gents.  I'm connecting the Electro to my laptop this evening to check if my programming is all in order.  I also have clearance from my fiancé to use our spare bedroom as a shack, yay!! This will mean that I can relocate the antenna and shorten the coax length to the loft drastically.  I'll let you know how I get on.

Cheers

Simon.

Hi Simon,

I hope you get sorted and fingers crossed it's a simple problem.

I must say, what a result as far as use of the spare bedroom for your shack/radio room! (Add 'office' to keep things sweet.) 

When my missus gave me clearance for ours I simply had a desk, chair and my radio.....now it's full of my radio gear, guitars, electronics components & tools, computers, etc!!!! But I've also got a kettle and fridge so sometimes she doesn't see me for hours on end.....

She doesn't mind though, often exclaiming "Get in yer box!" with a laughing smile which means she gets to watch her cookery programmes in peace.

Win - win.  


All the best,
Victor

Hi Victor,

Yep, it's definitely a 'win win' scenario!!  I've now checked my programming, and it's sound.  I've also set the CRT up with the UT-72 on a biscuit tin in the kitchen and managed to open-up the local 2m repeater again, as heard on my UV-5R....and yet another reason why these UV-5R's are really useful!

Now I know that the radio is working as it should, I'll be relocating my antenna in the loft and therefore shortening the coax, which should hopefully sort it out...

I'll post an update with my progress chaps.

Cheers

Simon.

Hi chaps,

A bit of a slow week radio wise......I've been working the early morning shift, which means that I'm flagging by about tea-time!!  However, I've managed to relocate the 'Sharman' (now spelled correctly!)  to the other end of the loft, pretty much directly above my 'shack', together with my Diamond A430S10 70cm 10 Element Beam......I say 'relocate' as there's still no coax connecting them to the outside world!!  Rightly or wrongly, I'm expecting great things from these two little antennas, at least better than my Nagoya UT-72 on a baking tray!!  I think the coax length will be about 10M - 12M max to each, so here's hoping.

The Diamond is there purely in my quest to access the local UHF repeater....it's a bit of a mission of mine!!

Cheers

Simon.