CB Signal Reports

Morning All,

I was just wondering how important it is for people to receive and be provided with audio / signal reports "You're 5/9 to me"

It seems to be a regular point of conversation or request from breakers. 

I ask because non of my current rigs have a proper analogue meter for signal strength. For accurate readings / reports is one required? 

Thanks

Tony
26CT4488

Morning Tony. With everyone's signal meters calibrated differently and lots of other variables like people using pre-amps etc, I wouldn't worry too much about it. You can use your ears to give most reports, e.g. if they are really strong with good audio then a 5/9, if they are less so then give lower figures.

If they ask you for their signal there's no harm and saying something like "I don't have an analogue meter on this radio but you're sounding a good 5/5", for example. Many people do this and that's more than fine.

Hi Tony,

Just about everyone gives a 5/9 whether it is or not.

You'll often hear on air with a DX contact, "Repeat please....Repeat please....Yes my friend, you are five over nine". How the heck could you be 5/9 if they had to ask you to repeat??

Sometimes if you give an honest report of say 4/7 the other party is not sometimes happy about this as they were expecting a 5/9.


The full system is R - Readability and S - Signal Strength. (There's also T for tone with CW/Morse use and hence why it's called the 'RST' system.)

It all works out as follows :-

Readability - R

1 - Unreadable
2 - Barely readable, occasional words distinguishable
3 - Readable with considerable difficulty
4 - Readable with practically no difficulty
5 - Perfectly readable


Signal Strength - S

1 - Faint signals, barely perceptible
2 - Very weak signals
3 - Weak signals
4 - Fair signals
5 - Fairly good signals
6 - Good signals
7 - Moderately strong signals
8 - Strong signals
9 - Extremely strong signals


So a 5/9 report is actually "Perfectly readable/Extremely strong signals". In reality any good contact could be 4 or 5 readability with signal strengths of 4 and upwards.

As you can see you don't really need to look at a meter at all knowing if someone is readable or not and whether their signals are strong enough to hear.

I know some get really hooked up in giving as well as receiving 'accurate' signal reports often for the prowess of their setup but in all reality it isn't all that important. Besides, most 'S' meters in any radio is supposed to have a standardised S-9 but often isn't and from there on varies wildly from radio to radio.


Most don't want to memorise the above list so often "5 over 9" is a simple quick convenient report to give.

If I can hear a contact and they can hear me then all is well with the radio world.  


All the best,
Victor

SangueG wrote:

Morning Tony. With everyone's signal meters calibrated differently and lots of other variables like people using pre-amps etc, I wouldn't worry too much about it. You can use your ears to give most reports, e.g. if they are really strong with good audio then a 5/9, if they are less so then give lower figures.

If they ask you for their signal there's no harm and saying something like "I don't have an analogue meter on this radio but you're sounding a good 5/5", for example. Many people do this and that's more than fine.

Hi SangueG,

Thank you for your response - as you say too many variables for a true accurate and repeatable signal report. 

Signal strength is one thing but useless if you can't hear a word the person is saying. I.e. you could be transmitting a S9 carrier with very low voice  or no audio which would mean the contact might not be made. 

I won't rush out to buy another radio... I have got enough already! Haha 

Regards,

Tony
26CT4488

Victor wrote:

Hi Tony,

Just about everyone gives a 5/9 whether it is or not.

You'll often hear on air with a DX contact, "Repeat please....Repeat please....Yes my friend, you are five over nine". How the heck could you be 5/9 if they had to ask you to repeat??

Sometimes if you give an honest report of say 4/7 the other party is not sometimes happy about this as they were expecting a 5/9.


The full system is R - Readability and S - Signal Strength. (There's also T for tone with CW/Morse use and hence why it's called the 'RST' system.)

It all works out as follows :-

Readability - R

1 - Unreadable
2 - Barely readable, occasional words distinguishable
3 - Readable with considerable difficulty
4 - Readable with practically no difficulty
5 - Perfectly readable


Signal Strength - S

1 - Faint signals, barely perceptible
2 - Very weak signals
3 - Weak signals
4 - Fair signals
5 - Fairly good signals
6 - Good signals
7 - Moderately strong signals
8 - Strong signals
9 - Extremely strong signals


So a 5/9 report is actually "Perfectly readable/Extremely strong signals". In reality any good contact could be 4 or 5 readability with signal strengths of 4 and upwards.

As you can see you don't really need to look at a meter at all knowing if someone is readable or not and whether their signals are strong enough to hear.

I know some get really hooked up in giving as well as receiving 'accurate' signal reports often for the prowess of their setup but in all reality it isn't all that important. Besides, most 'S' meters in any radio is supposed to have a standardised S-9 but often isn't and from there on varies wildly from radio to radio.


Most don't want to memorise the above list so often "5 over 9" is a simple quick convenient report to give.

If I can hear a contact and they can hear me then all is well with the radio world.  


All the best,
Victor

Hi Victor,

Thank you for your detailed response.

I have listened to the ham bands a few times and especially when there is a contest on everyone appears to be 5/9!

Another thing to note is RF gain control and how this affects signal readings. Presumably if you were trying to be consistent you would set and leave alone as this will increase or decrease the metered reading significantly. 

As you have summarised you cannot beat your ears for a recieved report. 

"If I can hear a contact and they can hear me then all is well with the radio world.  "


Well said! 


Regards,


Tony
26CT4488

Past 2 days here in North Finland, very clear 27 555, sig 1 of static but no DX.

Very faint 161 div about 1 hour ago .

No worries there Tony.

You'll have to forgive my often detailed answers but I know that others will also be reading this now and possibly in the future and may even be new to everything so gain a bit of useful information.  

Usually on a radio/rig (on all mine anyway) the S-meter rises accordingly depending on the RF gain setting as it is turned down. That way S-meter readings stills mean something and an S-9 will always be an S-9 regardless. I'm not sure on some of the CB circuitry out there or in the case of pre-amp use but goes to show one aspect of the marked differences between what is supposed to be a 'standard'.

Your own ears usually are the best way of giving a signal report.

Competition 5/9's on the Ham bands?
Signal reports aren't actually required so it's more of a courtesy than anything. If you're trying to bag as many contacts as you can in the allotted time-frame you don't worry about detailed signal reports!

Anyway, radio is too much fun to be worrying about S-meter readings.

All the best to you,
Victor

Victor wrote:

Hi Tony,

Just about everyone gives a 5/9 whether it is or not.

You'll often hear on air with a DX contact, "Repeat please....Repeat please....Yes my friend, you are five over nine". How the heck could you be 5/9 if they had to ask you to repeat??

Sometimes if you give an honest report of say 4/7 the other party is not sometimes happy about this as they were expecting a 5/9.


The full system is R - Readability and S - Signal Strength. (There's also T for tone with CW/Morse use and hence why it's called the 'RST' system.)

It all works out as follows :-

Readability - R

1 - Unreadable
2 - Barely readable, occasional words distinguishable
3 - Readable with considerable difficulty
4 - Readable with practically no difficulty
5 - Perfectly readable


Signal Strength - S

1 - Faint signals, barely perceptible
2 - Very weak signals
3 - Weak signals
4 - Fair signals
5 - Fairly good signals
6 - Good signals
7 - Moderately strong signals
8 - Strong signals
9 - Extremely strong signals


So a 5/9 report is actually "Perfectly readable/Extremely strong signals". In reality any good contact could be 4 or 5 readability with signal strengths of 4 and upwards.

As you can see you don't really need to look at a meter at all knowing if someone is readable or not and whether their signals are strong enough to hear.

I know some get really hooked up in giving as well as receiving 'accurate' signal reports often for the prowess of their setup but in all reality it isn't all that important. Besides, most 'S' meters in any radio is supposed to have a standardised S-9 but often isn't and from there on varies wildly from radio to radio.


Most don't want to memorise the above list so often "5 over 9" is a simple quick convenient report to give.

If I can hear a contact and they can hear me then all is well with the radio world.  


All the best,
Victor

I love this. This should be a "sticky" on every forum or website regarding UK CB. You absolutely nailed it with this Victor. Such a fantastic explanation to anyone new to the hobby. Great stuff.

Tony1091 wrote:

I have listened to the ham bands a few times and especially when there is a contest on everyone appears to be 5/9!

Another thing to note is RF gain control and how this affects signal readings. Presumably if you were trying to be consistent you would set and leave alone as this will increase or decrease the metered reading significantly. 

Bear in mind some contest rules REQUIRE a 59 be exchanged!

As you say, RF gain and a host of other things affect the S-meter reading, but the RST system predates S-meters anyway, so just go by what you hear.

If I've dialled back the RF Gain, or got the pre-amp on, or both, and they're a decent signal, I'd likely give a 58/59, even if my S-meter is showing S3, as I know WHY it is showing an S3!

If I can barely hear them over the noise, but the noise is S9, then I'd give a 49 or similar (and tell them they were in my noise), and conversely if their signal is low but perfectly readable nothing wrong with a 53 or similar either.  Quite often get that with SOTA guys running QRP but perfectly readable.

As Victor says, nothing funnier (outside a contest) than someone asking for a callsign and getting it wrong several times, then giving a 59!

Hi Chris,

I'm not the originator of this system in any way (credit is due to an American Ham W2BSR way back in 1934!) but simply passing on any info and help where I can. There's no gain or glory behind what I do, but if my forum 'waffle' assists anyone to enjoy the radio hobby (no matter what field of interest) then all is good.

However, I do really appreciate your words and thank you for posting.  

All the very best,
Victor

Great input there Jeff.  

Hope you're keeping well.

73